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Thread: Journey, Flower, Flow, and Abzu

  1. #61

    Default Re: Journey

    Wasn't aware the game sold poorly. Especially with the amount of attention it gets.

  2. #62

    Default Re: Journey

    It didn't guys... read carefully... they went bankrupt during developement(the last months of work were paid out of their own pockets) he also speaks of this in his dice presentation.

    As for him wanting to go multiplatform that's a given, he wants to reach the biggest audience possible with his type of games proving their viability(especially financial).
    He wants to have the kind of numbers that make publishers shut up about funding those games. That is of course very hard to achieve when your exclusive to a platform.

    And seriously that's a good thing, as much as I feel good about choosing the ps3 as my console and getting my hands on this , it's a damn shame that not everyone that wants to play it can.
    Last edited by DarthAsthma; February 11th, 2013 at 03:03 PM.

  3. #63

    Default Re: Journey

    Actually it sold incredibly well. It was bestselling PSN title of the year, broke sales records in volume and speed, the soundtrack keeps selling, got an artbook, and it did well enough to warrant a disk release months after the fact. "Bestselling game" does not equate to "sold poorly", so much as it does "studio only worked on one game for three years, kept pushing the game's release back, and needs more output." (They only have a staff of 12 guys... so they weren't making any other projects at the same time.)

    Considering that one release had to carry them for three years, and however long it takes to develop the next thing... well duh, of course they ran out of money. Any company would be hard pressed to get by on only one product for 5 years, no matter how well it was received

    http://www.polygon.com/2013/2/11/396...hatgamecompany
    Journey was a financial disaster, Chen tells me. Pushed back twice, the game bankrupted thatgamecompany. Eventually, it did make its money back plus some, but not Minecraft money, Chen says. While it was well received, it wasn't well received by a big enough audience for Chen.
    It was a disaster *before* the game came out because they delayed it so long.. for TWO YEARS. Of course there's financial problems when 1 year of development is spread into 3 without any other releases to keep cash flow going! It paid for itself... it's just not as big as one of the biggest things ever and they spent triple the production time on it they should have. (But the final game was worth it IMO... and they can carry those assets to new games now)

    Hey guy. Do some Journey DLC. You've got the assets and physics now. Spend a couple months and make an extra branch level or two. Or four player mode. Or black cloaks. I'll spend a couple more bucks for new stuff.

    Any event, they had a three game exclusive with Sony and that expired. It was pretty guaranteed their next game was going to be multiplatform regardless, we knew that when Journey came out a year ago.
    Last edited by Robby; February 11th, 2013 at 03:19 PM.
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  4. #64

  5. #65

    Default Re: Journey

    It's nice seeing thatgamecompany get so much industry love, but it's odd to me since I still think Flower was a much better expression of their design philosophy than Journey. Journey is much more--I don't really know the word--game-y than Flower. Honestly, the long push-back in development helped as much in terms of hype as anything.

    Jenova Chen is an odd figure to me. I've been following him pretty closely since months before Flower, and it seems he's pretty bad at delegating. Yes, he has a singular vision, but when he's talking about having to design the camera and all that...seems a bit much.

    Also worried--just a little--about his desire to go multiplatform and have a major financial success. He always gives lip service to Sony's support in the process, but I wonder if he knows how much better Sony has done for indies in comparison to the other two; it's one of their few remaining strong suits. Of course, I suspect he's planning on going iOS/Android/PC for the next game, and that's a whole other can of worms.

  6. #66

    Default Re: Journey

    Quote Originally Posted by tatermoog View Post
    It's nice seeing thatgamecompany get so much industry love, but it's odd to me since I still think Flower was a much better expression of their design philosophy than Journey. Journey is much more--I don't really know the word--game-y than Flower. Honestly, the long push-back in development helped as much in terms of hype as anything.

    Jenova Chen is an odd figure to me. I've been following him pretty closely since months before Flower, and it seems he's pretty bad at delegating. Yes, he has a singular vision, but when he's talking about having to design the camera and all that...seems a bit much.

    Also worried--just a little--about his desire to go multiplatform and have a major financial success. He always gives lip service to Sony's support in the process, but I wonder if he knows how much better Sony has done for indies in comparison to the other two; it's one of their few remaining strong suits. Of course, I suspect he's planning on going iOS/Android/PC for the next game, and that's a whole other can of worms.
    That you have to explain to me, I feel like your interpretation of their design vision seems to deviate from mine.
    They put emotion in the forefront when designing their games, the games ending up gamey or not has nothing to do with the philosophy.

    Any kind of game mechanic they choose is pretty much just a tool to invoke the emotion they want to focus on, it's not focused on how can we have mechanics that don't make this feel like a game but something different. It's about how can we use interactivity and create a rule set to guide people into a specific emotional zone.

    Everything else is secondary.
    As for Chen being bad at delegating, I feel like that's a shaky statement to make given that everything I've seen from interviews and what not rather shows that "thatgamecompany" takes a rather organic approach to developing. Chen may drive the core idea of what theme the next game will concentrate on but how they achieve that seems rather open to trial and error from the whole team(and with only 12 people it's still possible to accomadate for a lot of opinion).
    And with that kind of company enviroment I can see how it's hard to marry it with the realities of buisness, especially for a smaller studio.
    But then it's bad to make assumptions when I haven't worked there.

    As for the camera part maybe you can elaborate? Thinking about that kind of stuff seems pretty normal to me for a designer. I've seen a whole presentation about that regarding why diablo 3 uses the perspective it uses and how the art style they chose synergises with it.

    To close it off, I don't share the worry, because I don't know given with the nature of their games it seems pretty normal to me that I may not like every one of them. As long as they stay true to their stated philosophies and goals I'll be at least interested enough to always have a peek. It's rather surprising that everyone of their games resonated with me on some level.

  7. #67

    Default Re: Journey

    they finally fixed the game it was so boring before

  8. #68

    Default Re: Journey

    Holy shit I would totally play that.

  9. #69

    Default Re: Journey

    Kind of flies in the face of what Journey represents, but that's kind of what makes it so damn hilarious.

  10. #70

    Default Re: Journey

    I don't care that it's an April Fool's joke, I want it.
    To support Viz hosting all Jump manga for FREE and day of release, Arlong Park will now support the official release.

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  11. #71

    Default Re: Journey

    This adds some realistic depth to the game. It shows that despite how much trust you can put in a companion, there's always that chance you'd be stabbed in the back and betrayed.

  12. #72

    Default Re: Journey

    Would rather play Flower Kart.

  13. #73

    Default Re: Journey

    its really not appropriate for Journey... but a combat based game with those kind of jump/dodge/fly physics WOULD be pretty sweet.

    We've got a couple giant robot fighting games that do that a little but, none with Journey's level of crazy flight.
    To support Viz hosting all Jump manga for FREE and day of release, Arlong Park will now support the official release.

    Official chapter discussions now start Sundays at Noon, EST.
    Please do not post threads when scan sites release their version, and just discuss those releases in the spoiler thread.

  14. #74

    Default Re: Journey

    Enjoyed this Journey reference in Guacamelee:


  15. #75

    Default Re: Journey

    Cute.

    The completely random reference in Unfinished Swan is pretty crazy too.
    To support Viz hosting all Jump manga for FREE and day of release, Arlong Park will now support the official release.

    Official chapter discussions now start Sundays at Noon, EST.
    Please do not post threads when scan sites release their version, and just discuss those releases in the spoiler thread.

  16. #76

    Default Re: Journey

    Quote Originally Posted by RobbyBevard View Post
    Cute.

    The completely random reference in Unfinished Swan is pretty crazy too.
    Guacamelee is full of random game references, my personal favorite being a poster of Manny Calavera from Grim Fandango.

    The Unfinished Swan reference might have been the more impressive of the two, since it had something like a six-month window between the release of Journey and Unfinished Swan. How did you like that game, anyways? I'm in a minority, but I consider it one of my favorite gaming experiences of 2012. It lacked the emotional core of Journey, but it gave me a similar sense of exploration and adventure.

  17. #77

    Default Re: Journey

    http://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/1...in_Journey.php

    another gdc presentation a lot of stuff I've already heard from elsewhere, only new thing was that they actually started developing journey with the music and worked towards the score that was created.
    But then I still enjoy presentations about the game so I watched it all anyway.

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Edit: by the way is the tatermoog on the thatgamecompany forum the same as you? It's highlighted at minute 54:35 in the presentation. If it is haha :D that's pretty cool.
    Last edited by DarthAsthma; May 4th, 2013 at 07:37 AM.

  18. #78

    Default Re: Journey

    Quote Originally Posted by tatermoog View Post
    The Unfinished Swan reference might have been the more impressive of the two, since it had something like a six-month window between the release of Journey and Unfinished Swan. How did you like that game, anyways? I'm in a minority, but I consider it one of my favorite gaming experiences of 2012. It lacked the emotional core of Journey, but it gave me a similar sense of exploration and adventure.
    I liked it all right and was surprised by the ongoing variety, but I wasn't really driven to go for 100% on it or anything, and I have a bit of trouble with completely first person perspective on any game. It was an interesting evening at least. I was a bit annoyed when it got to the token dark scary things can kill you level that these games seem to think they need one of in an otherwise non-dangerous game.

    I think my favorite was the plant growing area, especially after unlocking the water hose. The three dimensional block creation area was interesting too.

    Quote Originally Posted by DarthAsthma View Post
    Edit: by the way is the tatermoog on the thatgamecompany forum the same as you? It's highlighted at minute 54:35 in the presentation. If it is haha :D that's pretty cool.
    I assume it is. Otherwise I won't be nearly as amused every time I go on there and see who created the Journey Apologies thread.
    To support Viz hosting all Jump manga for FREE and day of release, Arlong Park will now support the official release.

    Official chapter discussions now start Sundays at Noon, EST.
    Please do not post threads when scan sites release their version, and just discuss those releases in the spoiler thread.

  19. #79

    Default Re: Journey



    But...that...

    Huh.

    There's something I never expected to see again.

    [edit]WHEN DID THAT BECOME SEVENTY-FIVE PAGES?

  20. #80

    Default Re: Journey

    I watched those threads pretty closely for a while when people were dsicovering the tricks like fast flying, wind climbing (Never got the hang of that) glitch areas, and tripping on your scarf.

    Still love the game, but its been over a year now. its hard to keep going back to it.
    To support Viz hosting all Jump manga for FREE and day of release, Arlong Park will now support the official release.

    Official chapter discussions now start Sundays at Noon, EST.
    Please do not post threads when scan sites release their version, and just discuss those releases in the spoiler thread.

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