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Thread: Kingdom

  1. #81

    Default Re: Kingdom

    Quote Originally Posted by Aohige_AP View Post
    Yes. In history, he is known by the name he is called in the start of the first chapter, General Li Xin. (李信)
    We are not revealed how he came to be this family name yet.
    I have a question regarding Shin

    Spoiler:
    Historically speaking, Li Xin is supposed to lose in one of his first campaigns as general in the war against Chu, after arrogantly spouting that he only needed 200.000 men against a 500.000 men strong army of Chu. After that shameful loss, he pretty much vanishes from the history books because he had no significance to the unification anymore, especially after Wang Jian crushed Chu. Now i canīt really imagine something like this happening to the main character. Of course he is gonna have setbacks but this seems rather unlikely.
    Can you tell me how much the events in the manga differ from the history or if they happen at all?

  2. #82

    Default Re: Kingdom

    Quote Originally Posted by MiyamotoMusashi View Post
    I have a question regarding Shin

    Spoiler:
    Historically speaking, Li Xin is supposed to lose in one of his first campaigns as general in the war against Chu, after arrogantly spouting that he only needed 200.000 men against a 500.000 men strong army of Chu. After that shameful loss, he pretty much vanishes from the history books because he had no significance to the unification anymore, especially after Wang Jian crushed Chu. Now i canīt really imagine something like this happening to the main character. Of course he is gonna have setbacks but this seems rather unlikely.
    Can you tell me how much the events in the manga differ from the history or if they happen at all?
    isn`t the manga still running? could mean that there in no knowladge of that part of the story yet

  3. #83

    Default Re: Kingdom

    New volume cover


  4. #84

    Default Re: Kingdom

    Quote Originally Posted by Mizrath View Post
    ONE PIECE|EIICHIRO ODA
    This week's issue[in japan]includes the manga Kingdom, I've read all the volumes. It's manly and awesome!


    I think it was in the May 13 Issue of the English shonen jump.

    Edit: By the way is Kingdom a weekly or a monthly serial?
    It's published in Weekly Young Jump

  5. #85

    Default Re: Kingdom

    Quote Originally Posted by MiyamotoMusashi View Post
    I have a question regarding Shin

    Spoiler:
    Historically speaking, Li Xin is supposed to lose in one of his first campaigns as general in the war against Chu, after arrogantly spouting that he only needed 200.000 men against a 500.000 men strong army of Chu. After that shameful loss, he pretty much vanishes from the history books because he had no significance to the unification anymore, especially after Wang Jian crushed Chu. Now i canīt really imagine something like this happening to the main character. Of course he is gonna have setbacks but this seems rather unlikely.
    Can you tell me how much the events in the manga differ from the history or if they happen at all?
    Spoiler:

    I believe he was present in the final battle, just hardly mentioned - and he was never punished for the failure.
    I assume the fictional spin will be on resolving the grudge and making up for it in the final battle.
    I don't know how to say it in Chinese, so I'll just type it out.

    Li Xin's massive failure was when they invaded
    He was pulled from leading the army and 王翦 led and conquered them.
    (in this manga, he's the mysterious masked man)

    But after this, Li Xin was given another chance, and ended up conquering the last nation still standing, , with the two of his peers as co-generals (the two young generals he befriended in this manga, of course).

    So historically speaking, he DID make up for his failure, and although the final battle isn't all that illustrated, since this manga is centered on Xin, it's probably gonna be a lot more important.
    Obviously he's not the central figure in the victory in historical context, but that's no different from all the other battles he's been in.


    Quote Originally Posted by bepo View Post
    isn`t the manga still running? could mean that there in no knowladge of that part of the story yet
    Yes, it's still running, and nowhere even close to unification.
    Last edited by Aohige_AP; July 10th, 2013 at 09:32 PM.

  6. #86

    Default Re: Kingdom

    Chapter 349
    Spoiler:
    This manga is so great. I haven't any clue how the battle will end. The fight between Shin and Hou Ken is really intense and seems to be quite one sided. In my opinion, the horse fight (shin's horse biting Hou Ken's horse) was a little bit of an overkill.

  7. #87

    Default Re: Kingdom

    It's about time that annoying asshole got what's coming to him.
    Hopefully this will be the time for Xin to shine.

  8. #88

    Default Re: Kingdom

    350
    Holy mother of God
    Spoiler:

    Xin going toe-to-toe with Houken! Hell yeah!
    One-armed or not, it's still amazing.

    He's come a long way.


    Next chapter will be lead color, can't wait.

  9. #89

    Default Re: Kingdom

    Spoiler:
    Yeah, when Houken showed up in the latest arc, I was like, holy shit it's happening! And then he got his horse all amped up to fight. This comes at a time when the english scans for the manga is just getting to when Houken's fighting Ouki, so maybe it's finally time for Xin to show'em who's boss.

  10. #90

    Default Re: Kingdom

    Quick question: I'm reading this series on Batoto, and am up to chapter 50. However, two translations from two groups exist, and they are both so starkly different when it comes to names I can't tell which are correct. For example, one calls the main character Shin, the other Xin. These pages are prime examples:
    http://www.batoto.net/read/_/162672/kingdom_v5_ch51_by_vendetta-scans/7
    http://www.batoto.net/read/_/162595/kingdom_v5_ch51_by_turnip-farmers/5

    T
    he names, Go Kei and Wu Qing, Lord Shinryoukun and Xinling Jun, Shou castle and Xi castle ..... which are correct?

  11. #91

    Default Re: Kingdom

    They both are.
    Isn't it like insanely obvious that "Shinryoukun" is a Japanese pronunciation, and "Xinling" is the original Chinese one?
    I mean, you don't even have to know anything about either language to see it.

    You can easily tell a difference between names like "Chow Yun-Fat" and names like "Miyamoto Musashi".

    They're about as distinctly different from each other as English names and Russian names.

  12. #92

    Default Re: Kingdom

    I'd be able to tell that they were the Chinese and Japanese versions of the same names if they seemed remotely similar pronunciation wise. The only one's that sounded vaguely similar were that of the lord, and though I can't say I know how either language are pronounced, it seems to me that Shou castle and Xi castle should sound completely different. That's why I was confused.
    Anyway, thanks for the help.

  13. #93

    Default Re: Kingdom

    Quote Originally Posted by Porcelainpot View Post
    I'd be able to tell that they were the Chinese and Japanese versions of the same names if they seemed remotely similar pronunciation wise.
    Because Japanese and Chinese names usually don't have remotely similar pronunciations.

    I mean hell, the Chinese pronunciate Tokyo as DONJING for crying out loud.
    Last edited by Aohige_AP; July 25th, 2013 at 02:25 AM.

  14. #94

    Default Re: Kingdom

    I assumed that the Japanese equivalent of a Chinese name would be sort of similar to the Chinese one. For example in French and English: Jack and Jacque, Henry and Henri, Edward and Edouard, Louis and Lewis, etc.
    I'm guessing the Japanese versions of the Chinese names share the same meaning or something? Like Pierre, Peter and Pedro all meaning stone, loosely in the case of Peter. Or I may be wrong, I don't know.

  15. #95

    Default Re: Kingdom

    Japanese have two different ways of pronunciating a kanji, depending on its usage.
    On-yomi is loosely based on Chinese pronuncaition, but with centuries past since its original use, you can pretty much throw that idea out of the window.

    Hell, take the word "日本語 (Japanese)", which is "Nihongo", but Chinese would pronunciate it as "Ribenyu".
    If we were to use Japanese pronunciation for 北京 (Beijing), which is Peking in China, it'd be Hokkyou.
    (which we don't, and I'll explain why below).
    As you can see, it's COMPLETELY different, with almost no similarity at all.

    When Japanese pronunciate famous Chinese cities and locations, the Japanese reading is for the most part ignored, and use a pronunciation closer to the Chinese, because well you know, it'd be rude and dumb to call say... 上海 "Joukai" instead of "Shanghai".
    So it's read "Shanhai", even though that's not how you would say it in Japanese, but it's an international standard.
    However, a lot of Chinese don't do the same. They seem to read everything in their own way, making it completely different from what it's supposed to. That's why they say "Donjing" instead of Tokyo like the rest of the world.
    (Which, no offense to Chinese around, I find rather dumb. I mean, it's an international city, it would make a whole lot more sense to cast aside localization and read it in a way that can be recognized universally)

    However, historical names of people don't work the same way - I mean, you can't expect an average Japanese to know the thousands of different Chinese names in history. So Chinese heroes such as the ones in Kingdom (Spring-Autum feudal times) and Three Kingdoms are localized into Japanese reading.
    Unlike say, Beijing and Shanghai, which are universally famous locations and would hinder business transaction if not said right.

    In contrast, names of famous Chinese people of the current times are often read in their native names, instead of localized Japanese ones like historical heroes. Because you know, they're still alive and it'd be kinda rude otherwise. lol

    To sum it up:

    Present-day Chinese cities -> Kept in Chinese pronunciation
    Present-day famous Chinese names -> Mostly kept in Chinese pronunciation (written in katakana for easy reading)
    Figures from historical past -> usually localized into Japanese reading
    Historical Dynasties and other locale names not existing today -> usually localized into Japanese reading.

    It's pretty clear-cut how they are differentiated, it all depends on its relevancy to modern day.
    Last edited by Aohige_AP; July 25th, 2013 at 03:27 AM.

  16. #96

    Default Re: Kingdom

    I have to say, many thanks for the putting the time into writing that. It's interesting and very helpful!

  17. #97

    Default Re: Kingdom

    Yeah, pretty much confirmed to me what I was originally guessing. It sounds like the type of thing that only happens because they share a non phonetic writing system without having languages even remotely related to each other

  18. #98

    Default Re: Kingdom

    Correct. While Chinese had a large influence over the years, Japanese is a unique language that predates the importing of Chinese writing system into Japan.
    We're pretty much clueless on exact origin of the Japanese language, but a popular theory among linguists is that it belongs to family of Altaic language, likely passed down from Mongol descents who crossed the ocean to reach Japan.

    The kanji writing system was later imported from China, and incorporated into Japanese - thus applying a writing system to a pre-existing language, which led to having distinctly different languages sharing a common writing system.

  19. #99

    Default Re: Kingdom

    Heck, most Chinese dialects aren't mutually intelligible. At best, dialects are as similar French and Spanish. At worst, they can be as different as Russian and English.

  20. #100
    Discovered Stowaway leokiko's Avatar
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    Default Re: Kingdom

    For how much longer do you guys think the manga will go on? From 351.
    Last edited by leokiko; July 25th, 2013 at 12:24 PM.

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