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Thread: General Zelda thread

  1. #3501

    Default Re: General Zelda thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Count Mario View Post
    I hear people say that the art-style reminds them of toys or claymation, and I kind of see what they mean but doesn't hit the mark. If Nintendo was actually going for something like that, then they should make the game actually look like its made of painted clay models like Earthbound character art or made out of toys with quirky joints/pieces and wooden/plastic (not the cheap budgeted shiny kind) like in Toy Story. This game feels like this weird middle ground compromise between a typical Zelda style and an abstract style, but that ends up making it look weird.
    I think I'm the only one who finds the clay models of Earthbound either creepy or ugly.

  2. #3502
    The Die Has Been Cast Count Mario's Avatar
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    Default Re: General Zelda thread

    Quote Originally Posted by KageKageKing View Post
    I think I'm the only one who finds the clay models of Earthbound either creepy or ugly.
    I totally get feeling that vibe lol. Children's claymation like in the Rudolph the Red-Nosed can be unsettling to look at. But I think you can use that to your advantage. Especially for designing enemies.

    I'd prefer a toy aesthetic that's similar to how Sora, Donald, and Goofy look on the Toy Box world in Kingdom Hearts 3.

    Quote Originally Posted by Noqanky View Post
    As for Link's Awakening, I fail to see how the artistic style is a problem. So far it seems to nicely recreate the feeling of the original, and jives well with the gameplay. I don't think they were specifically going for claymation or toys, just going for a logical 3D transition of what it was before, so faulting them for not going all out with a toy/claymation style is faulting them for a design consideration we have, not them.
    That makes sense. Although I'm not saying that refusing to go with an arbitrary preference I have is a fault on them. Just that it would be more appealing to me if they went all-out in a surreal direction like that. Because that's usually how stylized art-styles tend to work for me. When making Wind Waker, they turned down making another psuedo-realistic Zelda and went all out on cel-shaded cartoons despite how radical a shift it was. It worked because it knew what it wanted to be and the game was made based on that. Although me speculating that they might have been trying something toy/clay-esque was purely conjecture based on first impressions. They probably weren't doing that (even if it would look totally freaking awesome and it's surprising how we haven't gotten a Zelda game like that yet).

    I get that it's mainly focusing on recreating its pixelated art-style with 3D shapes. But even on that end, I think it would work a lot better if they simply updated the pixelated art-style instead of ditching it for this weird middle ground between a pixel Zelda game and a 3D Zelda game. It doesn't really make me feel like it's a logical 3D transition because pixel games from decades ago were mainly trying to replicate cartoony or realistic likeness while dealing with limitations, not valuing those limitations in and of itself. Appreciation for pixelated visuals as its own definitive art-style came a lot later thanks to nostalgic hindsight and open-minded creativity, so trying to adapt a sprite game LITERALLY straightforward into 3D feels weird because, well, the original intention of the game was never literally trying to be like that? If they had modern tech back when first making the game (with the suspension of disbelief that they would still try making 2D Zelda games instead of jumping straight to 3D off the bat lol), it would probably look more like A Link Between Worlds. Or how Pokemon Let's Go looks in comparison to Pokemon Yellow. Which works a lot better for me because it replicates the classic camera view of older games but embraces looking more like its actual character art with the world and models.

    If you wanted to make a modernized top-down pixelated game... they should just make a top-down pixelated game? Like Shovel Knight or Sonic Mania? Because pixels can stand the test of time and not look outdated if you don't have a limited creative perspective? There isn't an objective rule saying you can't 3D-ify pixelated character models and I'm not saying this overall art-style vision is definitively bad or does not work. But I look at this game and feel like it's taking half-measures towards embracing whatever it is it wants to be, which gets in the way of me falling in love with how this looks compared to Wind Waker or Paper Mario.

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  3. #3503
    Voici La Chévre Wagomu's Avatar
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    Default Re: General Zelda thread

    I like the LA remake art style quite a bit. It has a cool cutesy approach to 3D with more realistic textures, which is what gives it that 'toylike' feeling. What's admirable about it to me is how effortlessly it translates the old style. LA was a Gameboy game, so it was built the system's hardware limitations. The map is divided into sorta chunky tiles collected in grids on small screens and the original art style (which is still pretty well-loved) was built around that to make a good-looking and readable world fit that kind of space. The new style is a 1:1 remake into 3D that manages to make space look organic without compromising the underlying grid structure. Plus having a cutesy art-style mirrors the plot in a way that's true to the original, which also built a contrast between its more detailed opening sequence and its more stylized gameplay.

    Since the tiles and characters are so small by design, I don't think they could make a more detailed toy artstyle readable without distorting or breaking the game's map to compensate.

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  4. #3504

    Default Re: General Zelda thread

    I guess I'm in the minority, I really liked Link Between Worlds, being one of the very few Zelda games I've actually 100%'d. Can't really say one way or the other about this LA remake since....I haven't played the original. Just pieces of the Oracle games.

  5. #3505

    Default Re: General Zelda thread

    Biggest difference is that oracles game had the option of making rooms bigger than one screen. This remake will as well, that is going to require some adjustments.
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  6. #3506

    Default Re: General Zelda thread

    Huh, I thought everyone thought Link Between Worlds was really great. I thought it was, anyway.

  7. #3507

    Default Re: General Zelda thread

    I liked it well enough, but I'm hard pressed to remember a single dungeon.
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  8. #3508

    Default Re: General Zelda thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Nobodyman View Post
    Huh, I thought everyone thought Link Between Worlds was really great. I thought it was, anyway.
    It's fine. It was appreciated when it came out as a throwback to the old style and a love letter to LttP. It did exactly what it set out to do.

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  9. #3509
    The Die Has Been Cast Count Mario's Avatar
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    Default Re: General Zelda thread

    I thought I'd see a lot more A Link Between Worlds defenses here like I usually do elsewhere. That's a nice surprise.

    Quote Originally Posted by Wagomu View Post
    I like the LA remake art style quite a bit. It has a cool cutesy approach to 3D with more realistic textures, which is what gives it that 'toylike' feeling. What's admirable about it to me is how effortlessly it translates the old style. LA was a Gameboy game, so it was built the system's hardware limitations. The map is divided into sorta chunky tiles collected in grids on small screens and the original art style (which is still pretty well-loved) was built around that to make a good-looking and readable world fit that kind of space. The new style is a 1:1 remake into 3D that manages to make space look organic without compromising the underlying grid structure. Plus having a cutesy art-style mirrors the plot in a way that's true to the original, which also built a contrast between its more detailed opening sequence and its more stylized gameplay.

    Since the tiles and characters are so small by design, I don't think they could make a more detailed toy artstyle readable without distorting or breaking the game's map to compensate.
    I don't mind a cutesy art-style. I'm just not all that into character models looking like literal Funko pops lol. It looks rather generic to me, shrinking Link down with less defined features and slapping black eyes without much else. Although I can get used to it since it's definitely not ugly, only not my immediately aesthetically pleasing Toon Link better fits my bill of appealing stylized cuteness (not that I want ANOTHER 2D Toon Link game though). The shiny plastic look isn't rubbing off on me well either, but I might like other environments and models better later on. I will say that I do like how the buildings have this diorama shape to them in accordance with the overworked setup.

    But you make a great point in your last paragraph. I can concede to that point above all else. But now my mind is thinking about how cool a full-on abstract Zelda art-style game would look. Like taking Puppet Ganon from Wind Waker and then making that a whole Zelda game, or at least the game's ability gimmick somehow. I would freaking love that.

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  10. #3510

    Default Re: General Zelda thread

    I'm in the camp that would be 100% okay with the new artstyle if it wasn't a remake of an old game, and brand new Zelda. As it is I'm about... hmmm... 75% okay with it.
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  11. #3511

    Default Re: General Zelda thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Count Mario View Post
    I thought I'd see a lot more A Link Between Worlds defenses here like I usually do elsewhere. That's a nice surprise.
    Sorry to disappoint; I was on a business trip. TBH I'm guessing at this point most people don't care enough for a deep discussion of LBW. I remember writing some pretty lengthy thoughts back when I first beat the game, and most people agreed it was pretty solid. I will never defend the item rental system (despite lots of people liking it), which I do think ruins the overall sense of progress and accomplishment. Not that I feel BotW did any better on that front. But the re-imagined overworlds, music, designs, etc. were all a pleasure. Character-wise Ravio was okay but Yuga and Hilda were particularly cool.

    The dungeons were really neat updates of the originals with new mechanics, designs and boss implementations. Some were actually even pretty difficult depending on the order you did them. I wouldn't consider them masterpieces among Zelda dungeons, but LttP itself started with pretty meh dungeons in the context of the whole series. I haven't heard any great point against it; mostly just "it wasn't different enough" or "it wasn't memorable enough" or "it wasn't my style." Without having played LttP as a child, and hence no nostalgia bias, I think LBW is genuinely the better of the two.

  12. #3512

    Default Re: General Zelda thread

    Soooooooo um...... Are we not gonna talk about it?

  13. #3513

    Default Re: General Zelda thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Shiebs View Post
    Soooooooo um...... Are we not gonna talk about it?
    The BotW sequel or the Awakening remake?

    We know nothing about the former except it looks like it'll reuse assetts, and the other we've known about for ages. Not a whole lot new to discuss that isn't already being covered in other threads.
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  14. #3514

    Default Re: General Zelda thread

    I think Zelda's new hairstyle is cute :)
    Really excited to see how they expand on the first game.
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  15. #3515
    Shipmate Lord Starfish's Avatar
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    Default Re: General Zelda thread

    I am super happy that Breath of the Wild is getting a sequel. Though... That zombie thing looked very much like Ganondorf. Can we, like... not? We already did Ganon last time and it was the most one-dimensional Ganon we've had since the NES. Now sure, maybe this new game will turn around completely and give us a much more interesting take, but... I mean I'd rather just have a different villain to be honest?

    But whatever, Breath of the Wild is legit one of my favorite games ever, and simply getting more of it is already more than enough for me.

  16. #3516
    Flagon Snaggin' Dragon Kaido King of the Beasts's Avatar
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    Default Re: General Zelda thread

    Can't wait to play this game in 2025!



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  17. #3517

    Default Re: General Zelda thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Kaido King of the Beasts View Post
    Can't wait to play this game in 2025!
    If they're reusing stuff, it shouldn't take that long. Mostly depends on how much of the map they reuse I think. But even if they make it from scratch they've still get the actual tooks and graphic assetts already, so...

    Give Link a couple new abilities and weapons, reduce the fragility of weapons and how annoying rain is and we're good to go.
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  18. #3518

    Default Re: General Zelda thread

    Link's Awakening looks incredible. The more I see, the more I'm sure they're 100% faithful to the original vision while adding cool new features like extra heart pieces. I was also worried it would become super hand-holdy, but so far all I see is slightly more guidance. For example, the Bottle Grotto boss now comments how your sword looks so puny that even the wall is probably stronger, hinting that you have to throw his bottle at the wall.

    The dungeon creator thing looks okay; not super exciting but I do get a bit of the appeal at least in terms of the design constraints and challenges ("make a dungeon in this shape that fills every square"), since it does all have to link up properly with tiles. I'm guessing the tiles are obtained by completing the dungeon to which they pertain. Aonuma was all "even people who know the game probably don't remember it perfectly." Well, I could tell from the custom dungeon they made exactly what dungeon every single room was from. So yeah, I think I probably do. But it gave me confidence that they didn't try to fuck up any of the dungeons since the rooms were identical.

    It's also getting a limited-edition physical release that includes a sizable art book (and a cool retro steelbook case for Europe, because fuck NA I guess). Absolutely pre-ordered that. The amiibo also looks adorable and I'll definitely pick it up when it goes on sale in like... a year, if Smash amiibo release times are any indication.

  19. #3519

    Default Re: General Zelda thread

    Link's Awakening was the first game I ever owned, so it's basically my ultimate "nostalgia game." I'm definitely getting the remake and I'm going to love it no matter what. ...But I really hope a dungeon maker isn't the only major new addition. I have no interest in stage builders, and I doubt this will be any different.

    Hyped as hell for BotW2. The first was terrific, but it had tons of small issues. If this game fixes them it could be one of the best sequels Nintendo has ever made.
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  20. #3520
    Discovered Stowaway andre's Avatar
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    Default Re: General Zelda thread

    Will get Breath of the Wild 2 if they remove or revamp the weapon system. I hated the system so much when I played it at a friends.

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