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Thread: Greg: Teacher of SUPER " OP " course !

  1. #3001

    Default Re: Greg: Teacher of SUPER " OP " course !

    We still don't know what happened to Zeus.

    And now Pedro and CO. can be saved by Jimbe and CO.
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  2. #3002

    Default Re: Greg: Teacher of SUPER " OP " course !

    Quote Originally Posted by maxterdexter View Post
    We still don't know what happened to Zeus.

    And now Pedro and CO. can be saved by Jimbe and CO.
    But Jinbe's under the impression that he died, so how does that even work? He has no reason to go back to WCI, so Pedro would have to come to him before something like that can happen.

  3. #3003
    Just as planned choperman's Avatar
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    Default Re: Greg: Teacher of SUPER " OP " course !

    Greg, one of my friends think Jinbei isn't joining this arc because zoro needs to prove himself stronger than him (probably by defeating Jack) Do you think thsi could be the case???

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  4. #3004

    Default Re: Greg: Teacher of SUPER " OP " course !

    Quote Originally Posted by choperman View Post
    Greg, one of my friends think Jinbei isn't joining this arc because zoro needs to prove himself stronger than him (probably by defeating Jack) Do you think thsi could be the case???
    I wouldn't think that, but I would think it could be the case with Sanji rather than Zoro.

  5. #3005

    Default Re: Greg: Teacher of SUPER " OP " course !

    Quote Originally Posted by maxterdexter View Post
    We still don't know what happened to Zeus.
    What bugs me here, is the fact that Zeus and Prometheus felt where Napoleon is, which means Napoleon and Prometheus should be able to detect where Zeus is, making means Big Mom could always know where the Strawhats are!
    I really hope Oda pays off this sub-plot next chapter, as well as several other sub-plots like Big Mom not knowing that Sanji made the cake. I feel waiting too much to resolve these will dilute their impact on the reader, only big mysteries could get carried to another arc but I'm not talking about those.
    I don't mind Nami carrying a homie around her for the rest of the manga, but I think a specially made one from Nami's soul could be more fitting than Zeus.

  6. #3006

    Default Re: Greg: Teacher of SUPER " OP " course !

    Quote Originally Posted by choperman View Post
    Greg, one of my friends think Jinbei isn't joining this arc because zoro needs to prove himself stronger than him (probably by defeating Jack) Do you think thsi could be the case???
    People still really believe Oda care about power scale between the crew members to the point that he would mould his story accordingly?!
    ďWhen I despair, I remember that all through history the way of truth and love have always won. There have been tyrants and murderers, and for a time, they can seem invincible, but in the end, they always fall. Think of it--always.Ē


  7. #3007

    Default Re: Greg: Teacher of SUPER " OP " course !

    He doesn't need to touch the story. Ever since fishman Island jimbe was paired with sanji, and even had sanji finish wadatsumi, so it was clear he still keeps zoro above. Jimbe still has the bigger Bounty, but that was the case with robin too for a while.

    And yeah, it was clear he wants to keep zoro clearly the strongest ever since thriller bark kuma, ''he can handle anything'' luffy's words.

  8. #3008

    Default Re: Greg: Teacher of SUPER " OP " course !

    Quote Originally Posted by uniaka ikuzakas View Post
    He doesn't need to touch the story. Ever since fishman Island jimbe was paired with sanji, and even had sanji finish wadatsumi, so it was clear he still keeps zoro above. Jimbe still has the bigger Bounty, but that was the case with robin too for a while.

    And yeah, it was clear he wants to keep zoro clearly the strongest ever since thriller bark kuma, ''he can handle anything'' luffy's words.
    Imagine if sanji stays back with Jinbe to save everyone from Big Mom by making her one more cake and he'll join back in Wano with Jinbe. People would riot.
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  9. #3009
    POE WUN BGR Greg's Avatar
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    Default Re: Greg: Teacher of SUPER " OP " course !

    That's a good point LSJ.

    Some people might wondering how I feel about the cake.

    Well, first of all, without the cake, Tottoland would have been destroyed.

    This is a fact.

    That's why Oda spent time blatantly showing us half a chapter of people around the country fearing for their lives and then relieved when the chaos passed.

    Also, without the cake, Mom *would* have destroyed Sunny. That's why the stakes were raised when it appeared.

    Saying it did 'nothing' is having a very, very bitter attitude.

    Did the cake do all I wanted it to?

    No.

    Not even close ^o^

    *BUT* I do believe that the cake must/will have an effect on the story/Mom in the long run. By that I don't mean it will slowly change her into a nice person ^o^

    I'm saying that RIGHT NOW, Pudding is poised to be THE HEROINE of WCI. What effect will that have on the story from here on out?

    Basically?

    I see this as Skypiea 2.0 where a bunch of people are going to throw their hands up in the air calling foul but a lot of what happened here will be VERY important down the line.

  10. #3010

    Default Re: Greg: Teacher of SUPER " OP " course !

    I agree that saying the cake did nothing is being bitter but after all I think Iím allowed to be bitter.
    Sanji is one of my favourite Strawhat, this arc was supposed to be about him after years of underwhelming accomplishment and it was disapointments after disapointments.
    This cake was supposed to redeem it all, it was the culminating point of a very long chase. So sure 900 was beautiful but it is mostly due to Oda direction not Sanjiís cake and 901 gives indeed a bitter aftertaste

    Otherwise i agree that Pudding will be the key to solve of that, especially if itís true that next chapter is the final one

  11. #3011

    Default Re: Greg: Teacher of SUPER " OP " course !

    Quote Originally Posted by Greg View Post
    Also, without the cake, Mom *would* have destroyed Sunny. That's why the stakes were raised when it appeared.

    Saying it did 'nothing' is having a very, very bitter attitude.
    I think people refer more to Sanji than the cake itself when they say that.
    As far as I can tell, it seems they don't like that at that point probably any decent looking cake would have been enough to lure Big Mom away from the Sunny and that the cake knocked her out for only... a few minutes maybe? Which would mean that the one who really saved the strawhats is Chiffon.
    Last edited by Tarek; April 18th, 2018 at 04:19 AM. Reason: I forgot to add something

  12. #3012

    Default Re: Greg: Teacher of SUPER " OP " course !

    Quote Originally Posted by Greg View Post
    Saying it did 'nothing' is having a very, very bitter attitude.
    I guess it does come down to a disappointment in Sanji's arc indeed. I have said similar things myself ("cake did nothing") and in retrospect it did affect the story in a positive way as you mention. However, none of these occurrences - whether it be preparing the cake, saving the Sunny or Big Mom finally eating - has had the grand impact I was hoping for. It happened mostly off panel, or was briefly commented by other characters, or felt lost in all the cluttered action... Compare with the conclusion of Zoro vs Pica. Now that was memorable (save for the "My Haki is bigger" part). The musical in 900 is the closest we got, but while very very well executed it's really about Big Mom being Big Mom and not so much about Sanji achieving anything, so I can't accept it as a satisfying conclusion to the cake subplot.

    When everything is said and done, the feeling is that Sanji as a character went through Hell and back this past year yet the conclusion to his character arc (so far) fails to meet the expectations all his trials built up. Does leave a bitter aftertaste indeed.

  13. #3013
    Saemon Havarian Razh's Avatar
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    Default Re: Greg: Teacher of SUPER " OP " course !

    Sanji making the cake has probably had the most impact on Pudding. Ok, it saved Totland and all, but the only ones who are aware of that are SH, Firetanks and Pudding. So I expect it will have a proper pay off in Elbaf. Might have been just the thing to trigger Pudding to actually leave the family, somewhere down the line.
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  14. #3014

    Default Re: Greg: Teacher of SUPER " OP " course !

    Quote Originally Posted by Greg View Post

    *BUT* I do believe that the cake must/will have an effect on the story/Mom in the long run. By that I don't mean it will slowly change her into a nice person ^o^

    I'm saying that RIGHT NOW, Pudding is poised to be THE HEROINE of WCI. What effect will that have on the story from here on out?

    Basically?

    I see this as Skypiea 2.0
    where a bunch of people are going to throw their hands up in the air calling foul but a lot of what happened here will be VERY important down the line.
    Can you delve deeper into this or are you going to do it in an article?

  15. #3015
    POE WUN BGR Greg's Avatar
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    Default Re: Greg: Teacher of SUPER " OP " course !

    Quote Originally Posted by Kdom View Post
    I agree that saying the cake did nothing is being bitter but after all I think I’m allowed to be bitter.
    Sanji is one of my favourite Strawhat, this arc was supposed to be about him after years of underwhelming accomplishment and it was disapointments after disapointments.
    This cake was supposed to redeem it all, it was the culminating point of a very long chase. So sure 900 was beautiful but it is mostly due to Oda direction not Sanji’s cake and 901 gives indeed a bitter aftertaste

    Otherwise i agree that Pudding will be the key to solve of that, especially if it’s true that next chapter is the final one
    Oh! Phhh! Yeah, that's no question. 901 is easily one of the biggest letdowns in the series in terms of delivering on answers, victories and promises.

    But there was a lot that works very well and keeps everyone in character.

    I believe there will be vindication for Sanji with that cake. It's coming.

    But! BUT!!!!!

    Where Oda clearly dropped the ball is in making Sanji **shine** in battle or at least strategy.

    When his secret escape plan was revealed to be....to run away...fast.... I had to facepalm. Yes, the story focused on Sanji. Yes the cake is AMAZING as an accomplishment.


    But come on man. You gotta know what your fans want....

    Yeah okay, sure, even if we know Oda *will* deliver, it stands that he did not deliver *here* where it was much needed. And I say 'deliver' in terms of fan expectations.

  16. #3016

    Default Re: Greg: Teacher of SUPER " OP " course !

    This wadatsumi switcheroo should have been set up by Sanji. We need Mr. Prince.
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  17. #3017

    Default Re: Greg: Teacher of SUPER " OP " course !

    I know Sanji just grabbing Luffy and dashing away is kinda of a let down....but what could Sanji plan if the island filled with people with powers he doesn't even know or could account for when making a detailed plan.

    Occam's razor or something.

  18. #3018
    The Die Has Been Cast Count Mario's Avatar
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    Default Re: Greg: Teacher of SUPER " OP " course !

    Quote Originally Posted by Jaime View Post
    I know Sanji just grabbing Luffy and dashing away is kinda of a let down....but what could Sanji plan if the island filled with people with powers he doesn't even know or could account for when making a detailed plan.

    Occam's razor or something.
    He could have at least predicted that Oven might use Boiling Hell again if they escape on the ship after seeing it last time on Cacao Island. He also knows about the Big Mama Chanteur's capabilities since he fought back against it with Nami, Chopper, Brook, and Caesar at Dressrosa. With a little bit more foreshadowing that the Big Mama Chanteur would show up before Chapter 900, and maybe the Fishman Pirates having a bit more presence in the arc instead of helping then disappearing than helping then helping then disappearing then helping, something could have worked. The pieces are all here, Oda just needed some minimal interest in wanting to connect anything that made Sanji shine outside of the cake.

    Sanji does not need to account for every single possibility like Aizen. Teach has plans but wings most of the process with general objectives with lots of improvisation. Sanji was able to sabotaged Enel's Maxim and opened the Gates of Justice only because he had the spontaneous free time and wit to wander around off-panel. It's not like these Mr. Prince were ever that meticulously planned. Not that they couldn't be though. The Rain Dinners shenanigans were silly yet brilliant.

    All Sanji has to mainly consider is what he could do if he manages to succeed in carrying Luffy to the Thousand Sunny. So that there is still some risk but at least some tactical preparation if his gamble works, which helps keep the Big Mom Pirates intimidating too.

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  19. #3019

    Default Re: Greg: Teacher of SUPER " OP " course !

    Quote Originally Posted by Greg View Post
    Oh! Phhh! Yeah, that's no question. 901 is easily one of the biggest letdowns in the series in terms of delivering on answers, victories and promises.

    But there was a lot that works very well and keeps everyone in character.

    I believe there will be vindication for Sanji with that cake. It's coming.

    But! BUT!!!!!

    Where Oda clearly dropped the ball is in making Sanji **shine** in battle or at least strategy.

    When his secret escape plan was revealed to be....to run away...fast.... I had to facepalm. Yes, the story focused on Sanji. Yes the cake is AMAZING as an accomplishment.


    But come on man. You gotta know what your fans want....

    Yeah okay, sure, even if we know Oda *will* deliver, it stands that he did not deliver *here* where it was much needed. And I say 'deliver' in terms of fan expectations.
    An unfortunate side effect of the germa having to look cool at least once tbh

    And also regarding oda, does he for some reason assume the readers have this great idea of sanji from a combat perspective so he doesmt need to show it? Because everytime sanji does something badass, (like when he knocked out raisan) it got followed up by him being knocked back himself. Or he did something cool but it wasnt the focus and the story moved on.

    Like how he blocked the Giant Genie from slicing carrot and there's barely any emphasis. I know oda doesnt follow the western fanbase at all but when you look at zoro and sanji post timeskip, one looks much better. One is used as a guy to hype other guys smetimes and the other is just badass and flawless honestly battle wise (god I hope zoro really has to struggle in Wano, he's too much of a smug asshole lol) since the timeskip.

    I just hope oda doesnt have sanji lose easily in wano to hype a powerful kaido guy only for a supernova/marco/zoro to take the guy out with a moderate effort. Just give sanji a good 1-2 chapter fight in there and quit making him get distracted all the time and be knocked around by small fries. Seriously any time sanji looks away in a fight he gets hit, but zoro manages to deflect it. This isnt Sanji <=> Zoro comment but oda framed them as being close so they shouldnt be this far apart in terms of performance

    Uh I dont mean to sound like I want DBZ from one piece but Sanji shouldnt be TIEN'd out of the story fightwise or any other way and though they tackled his personality issues in some of these fights a clear victory would have been nice.

    People were guessing, daifuku (cause he slapped pudding), oven (cause he tried to stop them from leaving) and Snack (because he was in the vicinity and "oda didnt bring him back for no reason")

    So if you think about it compared to anything sanji set out to do there are mixed results. He didnt really have a shining moment. Even the cake decoy wasnt presented there but capone took that on.

    From a story perspective

    Saving his family? They might all die anyways. Rendering the reason to go to the wedding pointless. Saving his captain? Pekoms got luffy put of the mirror and sanji and luffy almost died if not for the vinsmokes. His plan was literally skywalking out of there and nothing else. Having the cake knock out big mom? Sort of, now she back at full strength and ready to kill them all.

    So its a mixed bag for me.

    I know some people hate it but I love the entire chase scene from 873-901. It goes to show how frightnening the yonko are. I just wish sanji's role had more of an effect now to close up the arc satisfyingly. I dont doubt what he does will have a role here later but him having a golden moment here was expected for the arc so i feel like losing something.
    Last edited by Long John Silvers Rayleigh; April 18th, 2018 at 09:43 AM.
    Chapter 437 Discussion after franky decides to join the Strawhats:
    So who think Usopp is inside that duffelbag?
    H x H Chimera Ant Arc / OP Manga Spoiler
    Spoiler:



  20. #3020

    Default Re: Greg: Teacher of SUPER " OP " course !

    Quote Originally Posted by Count Mario View Post
    He could have at least predicted that Oven might use Boiling Hell again if they escape on the ship after seeing it last time on Cacao Island. He also knows about the Big Mama Chanteur's capabilities since he fought back against it with Nami, Chopper, Brook, and Caesar at Dressrosa. With a little bit more foreshadowing that the Big Mama Chanteur would show up before Chapter 900, and maybe the Fishman Pirates having a bit more presence in the arc instead of helping then disappearing than helping then helping then disappearing then helping, something could have worked. The pieces are all here, Oda just needed some minimal interest in wanting to connect anything that made Sanji shine outside of the cake.

    Sanji does not need to account for every single possibility like Aizen. Teach has plans but wings most of the process with general objectives with lots of improvisation. Sanji was able to sabotaged Enel's Maxim and opened the Gates of Justice only because he had the spontaneous free time and wit to wander around off-panel. It's not like these Mr. Prince were ever that meticulously planned. Not that they couldn't be though. The Rain Dinners shenanigans were silly yet brilliant.

    All Sanji has to mainly consider is what he could do if he manages to succeed in carrying Luffy to the Thousand Sunny. So that there is still some risk but at least some tactical preparation if his gamble works, which helps keep the Big Mom Pirates intimidating too.
    I was mainly just talking about his plan of getting Luffy to the ship, not the escape from there. SO the above points on Oven and Big Mom

    Yeah no coordination with the Fishmen Pirates around and JINBEI being on the ship is a weird issue.

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