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Thread: Pokemon Sword and Shield - Galexit Edition

  1. #461

    Default Re: Pokemon Sword and Shield - Galexit Edition

    Did he say "models from scratch", as before this shit hit the fan I understood as the level of polish wouldn't be up to par. As while the models are done, the textures and animations can't be done, as they need the wild behavior and proper high resolution textures.
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  2. #462

    Default Re: Pokemon Sword and Shield - Galexit Edition

    Quote Originally Posted by maxterdexter View Post
    Did he say "models from scratch"
    Omori (not Masuda, sorry) said it on the Famitsu interview.
    大森 今回のことは、増田とともに、かなり協議を重ねました。『ポケットモンスター サン・ムーン』の時点でも、(すべてのポケモンを連れてこられるようにすることは)実際はなかなか厳しい状 況だったのですが、ハードがNintendo Switchになって、モデルを最初から作り直すことになり、何かしらの選択をしなければならないと。ただ 、『ポケットモンスター ソード・シールド』を遊んでいただけるとわかるかと思うのですが(連れてこられるポケモンに制限があっても )ワイルドエリアやストーリーなど、その遊びの内容はかなりのボリュームになります
    https://www.famitsu.com/news/201906/13177936.html


    That said, I am sure once the dust settles down people will be more accepting about it. Once more pokémon are confirmed and a person sees their own favorites are in, they will be ok with it and less worried about something as abstract as "the game's soul". But still, I think this immediate backlash is very positive to show GF even the pokémon fandom has a limit to how much they can take even though our history suggests otherwise (we all had lots of fun with those games all the time, but let's not pretend they were not mediocre unimaginative games - although I do think with Alola they were finally attempting to try actual new things).

    And, who knows, this may also be good for GF. As far as know, they may have tried to delay the game and got a negative from Nintendo and/of TPC and this backlash, maybe even a factual significant drop on the sales, could help them realize the games should be prioritized if that's the case.



    EDIT: Also, the Famitsu interviewer asked if they intend to add more pokémon to the Galar pokedex with future patches (something some of us suggested here) and Masuda says they still haven't decided on that yet.
    Who knows, maybe the backlash now may be the deciding factor (I wouldn't be surprised if they made the reveal now exactly to evaluate how the fandom would take it so they could make the decision).
    Last edited by .access timeco.; June 13th, 2019 at 07:58 AM.

  3. #463

    Default Re: Pokemon Sword and Shield - Galexit Edition

    I'm seeing a lot of people "blaming" Dynamaxing for the lack of returning Pokemon, but is there any real evidence that that's an intense enough feature to be worth, say, 200 or so distinct Pokemon? I don't know anything about game making, but to me it feels like the Wild Area(s) are the real technical crunch.

    -----

    Also, I totally understand that "every Pokemon is someones favorite." I know that people have highly varied opinions that seem impossible to me and others like me, I get that.

    ...But I have a hard time believing that there's seriously anyone who has Jynx as their favorite. If most of the cuts are ones like that, I think the fanbase would cool down, especially when they come back in Pokemon Crazy Diamond and Pokemon Pearl Jam.

    Now that I'm typing this out, I think most of the cuts are going to be Sinnoh Pokemon to tie in with the inevitable remake.
    Last edited by MrBits; June 13th, 2019 at 08:10 AM.
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  4. #464

    Default Re: Pokemon Sword and Shield - Galexit Edition

    The world is bigger than it has ever been. That also takes modeling time.

    If this keeps on growing, they will just add in the 3ds models with the old textures and make them not be outside normal battles and be done with it. Have a farfetch 1st gen sprite with the 3rd gen ones.
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  5. #465

    Default Re: Pokemon Sword and Shield - Galexit Edition

    They are doing that because Totem pokémon were coded in the Gen VII games with different models than the regular pokémon instead of just reescaling them. But even if they were coded as different entries, they were the same models, they didn't needed to be built again, so I doubt it took any extra development time to implement them (or Dynamaxed pokémon) into the game.

    I think people are just annoyed that Masuda confirmed Z-moves and Mega are not in the game, so Dynamax is getting some extra hate... which is curious because in practical terms Dyanamax is a revamp of Z-moves, turning damaging moves into Max, adding new effects to it and to non-damaging moves (so, basically, Z-moves with a different name and without the awkward dances and ridiculous animations).
    As for Mega, I get why people would be upset, but I am particularly happy for that (love the concept, hated the delivery)

  6. #466

    Default Re: Pokemon Sword and Shield - Galexit Edition

    Didn't know about the lack of Megas. Don't really care about Z-Moves but even losing that is annoying.

    Just so much being cut from this is a massive downer on this game.



  7. #467

    Default Re: Pokemon Sword and Shield - Galexit Edition

    "cut", it was never here. Did they cut alola from the game? Or Kalos?
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  8. #468

    Default Re: Pokemon Sword and Shield - Galexit Edition

    I understand people being mildly upset that they MAY not be able to use some of their favorite past mons this time around, or being slightly concerned about competitive implications. But with no actual knowledge of what's even in or might be added later, it's pretty unreasonable to go further than that.

    Honestly it's people so outrageously obsessed with the status quo who make devs think twice about making any radical changes to the formula, and that's entirely a bad thing. Hey it's a new game, maybe try to accept it for what it is instead of assuming you have the Arceus-given right to have permanent access to all past features for every game ever. "Man, that's kind of a bummer" is about the reasonable reaction for those who were really looking forward to some specific gimmick team/run or whatnot.

    They're not dumb enough to stick it to collectors in a permanent way. If Bank/Home outright stopped storing your old collection or something like that, then there'd be some serious concerns in that respect -- but even then, remember that this is already pretty much a luxury! Carrying pokémon forward across generations was something they absolutely had no obligation, or possibly even expectation, to ever implement. Everyone is just really spoiled by now.

  9. #469

    Default Re: Pokemon Sword and Shield - Galexit Edition

    Whenever a new mainline game is released I only look forward to two things:

    1. The new features and game play changes it brings to the table.
    2. The new mons that inhabit the new region.

    Ever since Gen I I have always self-imposed to myself one rule: to complete the game with the stuff it provided. To that respect I could care less if some of my favorites didn't make it, to me the real thrill in the game was overcoming any wall with the mons featured not in the game's code but the regional dex.

    Which is to say, it doesn't mean I don't understand the people that are upset about their favorites being excluded. I understand them, I understand that every mon is a favorite and they are in their right to complain. And retrospectively this criticism is also a good thing for GF.

    The complaints I don't buy are the ones written down by outright hypocrites.

    The ones that claim they wanted to complete the national dex, when never once in their godamn lives they did that. That claim has become even less believable in the last years. As we are approaching the 1000th mark in the roster.

    Then we have the ones that are using Dinamax or other new features (like visible mons in the fields) as a scapegoat to justify themselves.

    So to clarify. You are upset because your favorites didn't make it to the roster? Valid. You are outraged because you can't cheat anymore through the competitive and/or claim to want to complete a national dex you never once intended to? Good riddance.

    PD:

    This bcklash will turn out silly if only the legendaries and a few forgettable mons aren't included in.
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  10. #470

    Default Re: Pokemon Sword and Shield - Galexit Edition

    No it is not spoiled and it's understandable to be "obsessed with the Status quo" when the formula for Pokemon mainline games has worked for so long and people enjoy it. People don't always need some massive shake-up and reinventing the wheel. Look where that's gotten Sonic series which feels the need to do that damn near every game.

    God forbid people don't want to take out features that have been there for a long time and people very much enjoy. And the uncertainty of the feature that may or may not come back or that the new feature they add might not make up for what is lost gives people reason to be upset. Especially considering I'm expected to pay more for this game compared to the past generation handheld games.



  11. #471

    Default Re: Pokemon Sword and Shield - Galexit Edition

    I've already said it's okay to be mildly upset about a particular aspect you were looking forward to. I also didn't say anyone needed to reinvent the wheel. Trying new things is good (let alone feeling you can even think about trying something new without receiving death threats). Sometimes they don't work. Sometimes people have an actual vision that doesn't match fans wanting the same thing 20 years in a row.

    What's going on so far is none of those things. It's literally just about backwards-compatibility. And they absolutely would have put it in if they could have, because they're not that stupid. My point is if THIS is getting people to throw whiny tantrums, heavens forbid they actually try anything different ever.

    Personally the fact that Rotomdex is back upsets me far more than anything else lol. That thing was annoying as hell. But guess what, I don't actually know how it'll work yet! Maybe it's actually fine.
    Last edited by Foolio; June 13th, 2019 at 10:18 AM.

  12. #472

    Default Re: Pokemon Sword and Shield - Galexit Edition

    Quote Originally Posted by maxterdexter View Post
    If this keeps on growing, they will just add in the 3ds models with the old textures and make them not be outside normal battles and be done with it. Have a farfetch 1st gen sprite with the 3rd gen ones.
    That's EXACTLY what they did in the past gens though. Excess mons that didn't make it to the main game just got dumped in using their old sprites, or with just very minor changes like their arms were moved or their mouths opened or tilted a little or something. They weren't up to date but they were in there.

    Lots of gen 3 sprites got used for every game that gen, and lots of Gen 4 sprites carried over to Gen 5. 6 they switched to cg models and did everything from scratch, but then those obviously carried over to 7, and now 8 with a different shader.
    Since you bring up Farfetched, Gen 4 and Gen 5.



    the never did something quite as out there as still using the gen 1 sprites going forward, things got massively retooled after gen 1, and then again when they moved to color.

    Obviously we don't know exactly how much work they're putting into uprezzing them int erms of textures and new animations (Walking around on the world, close up petting/grooming?) but it does seem like the bulk of them should be able to fit without a whole lot of work if they just need to be in representing.
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  13. #473

    Default Re: Pokemon Sword and Shield - Galexit Edition

    Talking about personal experience, I am not a breeder, I don't play competitively and I never had a living dex nor ever tried to do so (the closest I got to it was completing the Alola dex). I did bred some competitive pokémon on S&M for the first time, but not because I wanted to use them later, just because I wanted the satisfaction of "having the perfect Caterpie". Also, as I mentioned some times, my personal rule is that I will always use only newly introduced Pokémon in my teams.

    So, all in all, while I do support people voicing their complaints (mainly because I don't think GF is coming out honestly about it and because I think the games are getting progressively more rushed and it's about time we complain it) and while I think this change goes against the very core of the Pokémon "soul", my personal experience should not be hampered by old pokémon not being there.

    The only problem is exactly this time, because of multiple saves, I was planning to actually replay a pokémon game and use different teams other than my "official" one... The one single time I plan to use old 'mon and it turns out to be the one time they may not be available.
    But I can't get mad for that because it is a very specific and individual demand. Right now I will keep an eye on which Pokémon are confirmed to be in Galar, if the ones I was hyped to use turn out to be there, good enough for me. If not, I may end up deciding to skip SwSh and wait for the third expanded version (which will not be much of a change, I always buy the first version and skip the remakes and third versions).

  14. #474

    Default Re: Pokemon Sword and Shield - Galexit Edition

    Not sure if this has been brought up, but think back to Gen 3 when they only carried over 70 out of 250 mons to the "HoennDex." The game still had great replayability even though in hindsight, I'm indifferent to many of the Pokemon from the region. I was much more fond of Pokemon from the first couple generations but that didn't stop me from playing Ruby and Emerald at least 5 times a piece. Plus if we're cutting many Pokemon out we could be getting more additions than usual. I've liked the quality of the last 2 gens but imagine if we kept the same standard but with over 100 new ones. That'd be worth it imo.


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  15. #475

    Default Re: Pokemon Sword and Shield - Galexit Edition

    I mean the thing is, from a collecting/completionism standpoint, it's not like there will be a lack of that. There's still the original goal of completing the entire (regional) dex, and it will probably be the biggest one to date. I don't see how it goes against the soul of the series to have to leave out some past things.

    To me it feels like someone looking at the new Animal Crossing game and being outraged that they can't transfer their painstakingly curated furniture collection from previous titles. You've never been able to, so nobody expects to be able to. But that's about the only difference. Sure the game doesn't have a tagline of "gotta furnish them all" but obviously there are plenty of people going for good collections and sinking tons of hours into it.

  16. #476

    Default Re: Pokemon Sword and Shield - Galexit Edition

    You know if they want to do a reboot then stop half assing it every time.
    Long gone are the days when Game Freak tries to be creative with their mechanics, there is no need to.
    Not that I'm saying there's no need for effort to upscale the graphics but people need to see that this is a vehicle that oils itself.
    Basically Pokemon sells no matter what they do.
    The older generation, people like me and you are no longer their main business target.
    Look at how the lackluster Kanto Remake brought so many casuals in.
    Look at how much money Go bring despite people predicting it will die out.

    Whatever creativity or new innovation people expect Game Freak to bring it is just not going to happen.
    That ivory tower is stuck way up their corporate diamond asses to bother.
    You'll have a lot more fun appreciating little surprises from cool designs or the rare occasion thing they do right.

    Their market research is not us but young kids and teens who enjoy flashiness and wow factor.
    I mean that pretty much explains the choice of removing the national dex.

    Whatever repercussions anyone is hoping for is going to get waved off anyway because money doesn't care.

  17. #477
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    Default Re: Pokemon Sword and Shield - Galexit Edition

    Not having every pokemon coded in the game isn't a small thing or a minor complaint. This is the first mainline game in the series history without that capability. Contrary to an earlier post, I'm sure every pokemon in the series (or at least one pokemon from every family) is someone's favorite. Everyone's going to feel some way about the lack of whichever mons are missing and I don't think it's at all fair to try and say how angry they're allowed to get at the change, bar those actually causing destruction or harrassing people for it. Otherwise, any rage is fair game from my viewpoint when the series has been about catching them all from the start.

  18. #478

    Default Re: Pokemon Sword and Shield - Galexit Edition

    Quote Originally Posted by andre View Post
    Not having every pokemon coded in the game isn't a small thing or a minor complaint. This is the first mainline game in the series history without that capability. Contrary to an earlier post, I'm sure every pokemon in the series (or at least one pokemon from every family) is someone's favorite. Everyone's going to feel some way about the lack of whichever mons are missing and I don't think it's at all fair to try and say how angry they're allowed to get at the change, bar those actually causing destruction or harrassing people for it. Otherwise, any rage is fair game from my viewpoint when the series has been about catching them all from the start.
    I had stopped playing pokémon at that time, but I'm pretty sure gen 3 had no way to connect with the previous 2 gens, leaving you unable to transfer. That aside, I disagree with almost everything you said. Except about how everything is probably someone's favorite, but the issue isn't that so much as whether they'll act like it's the end of the world and be toxic about it.

  19. #479
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    Default Re: Pokemon Sword and Shield - Galexit Edition

    Quote Originally Posted by Foolio View Post
    I had stopped playing pokémon at that time, but I'm pretty sure gen 3 had no way to connect with the previous 2 gens, leaving you unable to transfer. That aside, I disagree with almost everything you said. Except about how everything is probably someone's favorite, but the issue isn't that so much as whether they'll act like it's the end of the world and be toxic about it.
    What is acting like the end of the world? If that means harassing people, making threats, and acting a fool, then I'm with you. If it means not buying the game or discussing how disappointed you are in the decision, then I think it's pretty fair when Gotta Catch em All has been the theme of this series from the beginning. The treehouse video with the announcement has almost three times as many dislikes as likes right now, over 40,000 of them. It might not be a big deal to you, but it is to a lot of people.

    As for Gen 3, every pokemon was coded into the game, but you couldn't transfer all of them initially, since they couldn't figure out a way to make the GB compatible with the GBA, and people were pissed about it. It was possible to acquire every pokemon, though, through the base games, frlg, and the Gamecube games.

  20. #480

    Default Re: Pokemon Sword and Shield - Galexit Edition

    Gotta Catch 'Em All*

    *Even decades from now when there will be nearly 1000 (which we totally have the foresight to know), no matter how untenable the notion becomes. And we don't mean all the ones in the regional dex -- we mean every single one ever, every time, within every game. Incidentally "Catch" will often mean "transfer your already-owned stuff from old games." Same thing though right? Obviously, maintaining a living dex in our future very clever cloud storage Bank/Home service does not count; you have to be able to actually use them in-game, every game. We know your life has no meaning otherwise.

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