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Thread: Chapter 955: ENMA

  1. #41

    Default Re: Chapter 955: ENMA

    The fact that he's still ok (doesn't fall out of G4) and doesn't have to increase the size of his arm (if it's not a mistake) after performing King Kong Gun should be taken into consideration

  2. #42
    Stowaway w/ 18k posts Kishido's Avatar
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    Default Re: Chapter 955: ENMA

    Yeah this making it black upgrading the rank is strange.

    WBs Bisento isn't black so what will happen if it turns black ?

  3. #43
    Saemon Havarian Razh's Avatar
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    Default Re: Chapter 955: ENMA

    Quote Originally Posted by Blissed View Post
    Because it's not necessary. He didn't take the time to show it because he's never done so before in the first place. And I know you earlier snarked a bit that Oda made space to show off the secondary characters/civilians, but my stance is that that was more important to show and set the tone for this chapter. Namely the juxtaposition between their lack of hope and the Scabbards marching onwards looking very determined, I thought that was well done, and preferable to basic training panels from the others that we don't actually need to see. Only Luffy and to a lesser extent Zoro have a specific thing they're training towards achieving in those last few days before the festival.
    I'm arguing he's being sidelined because Oda doesn't take time to show him, or to spend as much time on his perspective as he does on Luffy's and Zoro's. Well that goes for most of Strawhats here. Oda is focusing on these new characters and in the process SH have become almost secondary characters in their own damn story.

    Quote Originally Posted by Blissed View Post
    But seriously, something like him simply staring at his cannister would've satisfied you? From what I've seen, you've made it clear that you harbor a (understandable) negative bias towards the character, and I frankly don't feel like anything less than a proper full-fledged fight would do the trick for you anyhow. Otherwise I don't see why you need to nitpick him not training, when again, he's literally never done so before.
    I feel like you're stubbornly refusing to understand what I'm saying. Don't have negative bias toward Sanji. Sanji is a fictional character. My problem is Oda sidelining him and others in favor of new characters. Well of course I want Sanji to have an epic fight. Fights are a big part of One Piece. Most of important characters are strong fighters.

    Quote Originally Posted by Blissed View Post
    If this arc so far only had Zoro and Luffy gain power ups at this point in time, where Sanji didn't have his new raid suit, I'd completely agree with your cynical assertion that Oda's perception of him has clearly changed. But that isn't what happened, not to mention we just came off an Sanji-centered arc where Luffy went to go and retrieve him in part due to needing his strength for the upcoming war.
    Luffy - went all out on Kaido, lost badly, got imprisoned, started focusing on learning new skill, met a man who could help him develop it, proceeds to spend all his time perfecting it so he can have a fighting chance

    Zoro - got in couple skirmishes, gets in a fight with a weapon collector, fights to save on of central characters in this arc, gets wounded, heals, observes an execution, gets emotional, has a skirmish with one of central characters in this arc, escapes with one of central characters in this arc, fights some more, loses one of his swords, gets a new sword, trains to use it better for a coming battle. Oh right, turns out Zoro's origins might be in Wano as well, and he's now using the sword his potential ancestor made...

    Sanji - gets a raid suit from his villainous family which he despises, promises never to use it, gets into a jam where he needs to hide his face and, instead of using any piece of cloth to hide his face, he uses the suit which he happened to be carrying with him all the time despite saying he'll never use it. But it's kinda cool because he can turn invisible and it helps his dream of being a stalker...

    Which of these was most lazily handled in your opinion?

    So much potential to show off Sanji's new skills, especially from someone as imaginative as Oda, and he ends up resorting to a stat boosting suit.

    Quote Originally Posted by Blissed View Post
    As for Sanji having competition, I'm really not worried.
    Well I am. Apart from Luffy and Zoro hogging all the glory, we have rest of the Strawhats, we have 9 Scabbards, Law, rest of Supernova which might swing either way, potential Jinbe and Marco appearances...
    Last edited by Razh; September 14th, 2019 at 02:51 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Outerspec View Post
    Trying to understand Bleach is like trying to drink a bottle of bleach.

    It makes no sense and you'll be dead before you're finished.

  4. #44

    Default Re: Chapter 955: ENMA

    Again, I disagree with your argument because we just came off of WCI, an arc centered around Sanji, and the fact that alongside Luffy and Zoro, Sanji has received his own respective power up, making it clear Oda hasn't forgotten about Sanji. Hell, this supposedly sidelined character has done enough already to have also gained his own reputation in Wano, his being "Soba Mask". You may disagree with the execution of some things like the raid suit, or bemoan the fact that Zoro overall does indeed have a bigger role this arc, but at the end of the day, that is not the same thing as being actually sidelined. We're just not going to agree on that. Also the way you describe what Sanji has done so far in this arc is exactly what I'm talking about when I say you have a noticeable negative bias towards the character lol

    Well either way, there's nothing else left to say really, agree to disagree and all that.

  5. #45

    Default Re: Chapter 955: ENMA

    actually, to be more accurate, all the monster trio only having their own power up when they landed here at wano.

    but theres still possibility that sanji might not using the raid suit during battle in this arc. because he doesn't need to hide his face anymore.

    and lastly, sanji raid suit specialty is invisibility aside from bullet proof and speed. means, no 'power up' actually for sanji for this arc yet.
    Daaammnnn!

  6. #46
    Saemon Havarian Razh's Avatar
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    Default Re: Chapter 955: ENMA

    Quote Originally Posted by Blissed View Post
    Again, I disagree with your argument because we just came off of WCI, an arc centered around Sanji, and the fact that alongside Luffy and Zoro, Sanji has received his own respective power up, making it clear Oda hasn't forgotten about Sanji. Hell, this supposedly sidelined character has done enough already to have also gained his own reputation in Wano, his being "Soba Mask". You may disagree with the execution of some things like the raid suit, or bemoan the fact that Zoro overall does indeed have a bigger role this arc, but at the end of the day, that is not the same thing as being actually sidelined. We're just not going to agree on that. Also the way you describe what Sanji has done so far in this arc is exactly what I'm talking about when I say you have a noticeable negative bias towards the character lol

    Well either way, there's nothing else left to say really, agree to disagree and all that.
    An arc centered around Sanji in which his greatest feat was baking a cake and the most beating he gave was towards his own captain. WCI left much to be desired, especially where Sanji is concerned.

    Again with that noticeable negative bias crap... Acknowledging an author has been doing a piss poor job with a character is not a negative bias.
    Quote Originally Posted by Outerspec View Post
    Trying to understand Bleach is like trying to drink a bottle of bleach.

    It makes no sense and you'll be dead before you're finished.

  7. #47

    Default Re: Chapter 955: ENMA

    Quote Originally Posted by camey View Post
    and lastly, sanji raid suit specialty is invisibility aside from bullet proof and speed. means, no 'power up' actually for sanji for this arc yet.
    This is misinformation. It's already been established in WCI that the raid suit also enhances you physically. Germa 66 bemoaned the fact that they weren't able to match up to the BM Pirates without their suits right as they were about to be murdered. Then once they put it on, we see that they were then clearly able to pose a threat. Even before that, in Chapter 833, the Germa soldiers comment on Sanji's strength, remarking how tough he is despite not having a raid suit on. Even taking the Soba Mask chapter in isolation, it clearly increased his durability as he barely felt Page One's attack.

  8. #48

    Default Re: Chapter 955: ENMA

    why need such hate towards oda storyline?

    of course there's reason and story build up within the said arc to another arc.
    Daaammnnn!

  9. #49

    Default Re: Chapter 955: ENMA

    Quote Originally Posted by Razh View Post
    An arc centered around Sanji in which his greatest feat was baking a cake and the most beating he gave was towards his own captain. WCI left much to be desired, especially where Sanji is concerned.

    Again with that noticeable negative bias crap... Acknowledging an author has been doing a piss poor job with a character is not a negative bias.
    But WCI was also an arc where every single character kept going on and on about how great Sanji is and the guy that criticizes him (Judge) gets consistently humilliated for it. Seriously, that arc was basically Oda giving the middle finger to anyone that has ever talked crap about Sanji in a borderline vindictive way.

    You can dislike the way it was handled, but saying things like the author doesn't care about Sanji or has it out for him after that is honestly ridiculous.

  10. #50

    Default Re: Chapter 955: ENMA

    Quote Originally Posted by Blissed View Post
    This is misinformation. It's already been established in WCI that the raid suit also enhances you physically. Germa 66 bemoaned the fact that they weren't able to match up to the BM Pirates without their suits right as they were about to be murdered. Then once they put it on, we see that they were then clearly able to pose a threat. Even before that, in Chapter 833, the Germa soldiers comment on Sanji's strength, remarking how tough he is despite not having a raid suit on. Even taking the Soba Mask chapter in isolation, it clearly increased his durability as he barely felt Page One's attack.
    is that the reason sanji able to damaging yonji because yonji did not put raid suit and physically, without suit, sanji is stronger than any of his siblings?
    Daaammnnn!

  11. #51

    Default Re: Chapter 955: ENMA

    The arc centered around Sanji had random opponents and his brothers constantly mock his abilities, one of which was one of the main improvements Sanji worked on over the timeskip.

    And then he had to accept the suit and thus the technology of his abhorred father, something he swore he would never do, just to be relevant power-wise and be comparable to Zoro in this arc.

    Meanwhile Zoro gets a powerup and training montage alongside Luffy while people are constantly praising him for his strength and resilience.

    Even putting everything else aside before actual WCI (like Dressrosa, or the nosebleed fiasco, or Sanji getting his main asset cracked), to suggest the fandom has a negative bias against Sanji when Oda has been constantly crushing the character, is kind of hilarious, especially when you compare it to how he treats Luffy and Zoro.

  12. #52

    Default Re: Chapter 955: ENMA

    kind of wonder how will be the reaction of sanji haters will say if zoro get the enma katana much earlier than sanji decide to use the raid suit. maybe they will even shout loudly that sanji is lousy character that need cheap hand.
    Daaammnnn!

  13. #53

    Default Re: Chapter 955: ENMA

    Quote Originally Posted by camey View Post
    is that the reason sanji able to damaging yonji because yonji did not put raid suit and physically, without suit, sanji is stronger than any of his siblings?
    Sanji beat Yonji while he had the suit on. Between that and the subtext of the arc, including his fight against Judge, IMHO the implication is that he's stronger than all of them individually despite their raid suits. Not a power scaling thing, I just felt that's what the subtext was telling us.

    Quote Originally Posted by MiyamotoMusashi View Post
    to suggest the fandom has a negative bias against Sanj
    I never said anything about the overall fandom, please don't put words in my mouth.

  14. #54
    Saemon Havarian Razh's Avatar
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    Default Re: Chapter 955: ENMA

    Quote Originally Posted by Blissed View Post
    I never said anything about the overall fandom, please don't put words in my mouth.
    Would ask you the same.
    Quote Originally Posted by Outerspec View Post
    Trying to understand Bleach is like trying to drink a bottle of bleach.

    It makes no sense and you'll be dead before you're finished.

  15. #55

    Default Re: Chapter 955: ENMA

    Quote Originally Posted by Razh View Post
    Would ask you the same.
    I'll keep that in mind.

  16. #56

    Default Re: Chapter 955: ENMA

    Quote Originally Posted by Blissed View Post
    Sanji beat Yonji while he had the suit on. Between that and the subtext of the arc, including his fight against Judge, IMHO the implication is that he's stronger than all of them individually despite their raid suits. Not a power scaling thing, I just felt that's what the subtext was telling us.



    I never said anything about the overall fandom, please don't put words in my mouth.
    Which in this case your accusation of Razh is part of.

  17. #57

    Default Re: Chapter 955: ENMA

    Well i can absolutely put those kinds of words in my own mouth.

    AP has a tendancy to put a negative spin on anything Sunkist does.

    And that is most likely to have more to to with their perception than with author intent.

  18. #58

    Default Re: Chapter 955: ENMA

    Quote Originally Posted by theackwardstation View Post
    This chapter ends the second act of Wano, so I should leave my thoughts on the story up to this point.

    If Oda suddenly appeared in front of me a year ago telling me his ideas for Wano and showing me all his notebooks, I would be completely excited about almost everything. The story is pretty good overall, the characters from Wano are all interesting, and it's really cool that the alliance had to perform all these logistical tasks in order to fight Kaidou: recruiting people, finding weapons, finding the blueprint of Kaidou's mansion and some other stuff. Not to mention the natural hype of going against Kaidou, a super powerful Yonkou that is behind other interesting parties like Orochi and his subordinates.

    Nonetheless, as much as I can praise the story itself, the actual writing was really disappointing to me. Most of the most relevant subplots were completely rushed, not to mention the ones that basically happened offscreen.

    Let's just think about Shutenmaru for a second. This character was introduced in the story burdening a conflict against his comrades that disappeared 20 years ago, which is a sentiment that have a lot of potential for good storytelling. However, this entire subplot happened in the dark, with a few pages scattered across many different chapters only to explain the offscreen facts that convinced Shutenmaru to accept Kinnemon again. So what's the point, really? Why should we have this subplot at all if it's just gonna happen offscreen? Oda should have erased this conflict from the story and made Shutenmaru join the alliance from the beginning... or else actually show it.

    This may be only one example, but that's my feeling for most of the second act. For example, maybe the most important event that happened was Yusuie's death, which was done fairly well, but the story didn't care at all to introduce him properly before his grandiose execution. He first appeared out of nowhere with Zoro in a scene that consisted of Yasu recalling how they met, which is a shitty way to spare Oda of the trouble of actually showing their first meeting. But that's not the only problem, since we barely spent any time with him after that. Yasuie's only character trait was his constant laughter despite his misery, and yet this behavior was also shared by all citizens from Ebisu Town. And then suddenly Oda decides to show us in one chapter that Yasu is a super loved guy by the people of his town and in the next he is suddenly being crucified by Orochi... what? That escalated far too quickly, and so the death that was supposed to be a meaningful moment lost half of its emotional impact because Yasu was nobody to the readers.

    The funny thing is that Yasuie is from the Shimotsuki family, the same people that made Zoro's Wado Ichimonji (and now Enma), a family possibly related to Koushiro and Kuina, and even Ryuuma was a Shimotsuki. So just imagine how much Yasu could have talked about with Zoro when they first met! All these details that could have made him feel more like a real character.

    Meanwhile all these meaningful subplots poorly handled (especially the ones with the Strawhats), we have Luffy defeating all of Udon's goons one after the other. Remember when I said at the beginning that I would be excited about almost everything? Well, there is a subplot that I actually detest, and that's the Udon subplot. Honestly, I don't have the energy right now to show my hate for this prison and everything that happened there, but it's insane how much time we spent there watching that disaster unfold while the good stuff outside was being rushed.

    I'm still hyped about the next acts, but I'm not really happy about the last 30 chapters.
    All of the subplots are for the anime. SO don't worry.XD

  19. #59

    Default Re: Chapter 955: ENMA

    I could see why fans would want to see sanji train like zoro and luffy in the 9 days for the final, since he is about this raid suit power ranger only since wano, not in the first 930 chapters, before it was made a point that he was born normal and only because of training he devoloped super strength, super speed. It's clear that he trains to get like this, he trained like usain bolt for 2 years running for okamas.


    Based on how battles improve you, sanji and zoro fighting all the time on the ship is clear training, you don't need to lift weights to count as training.
    Like sanji did nothing in the last 5-6 days left to onigashima, we didn't even see him cook like some special recipe to boost army of 4000. Even showing that he can cook for 4000 like it was nothing, same way franky can repair many ships in a few days would still be something, if you don't give a shit at all about his combat and stuff.
    Last edited by uniaka ikuzakas; September 14th, 2019 at 01:57 PM.

  20. #60

    Default Re: Chapter 955: ENMA

    Quote Originally Posted by wolfwood View Post
    Well i can absolutely put those kinds of words in my own mouth.

    AP has a tendancy to put a negative spin on anything Sunkist does.

    And that is most likely to have more to to with their perception than with author intent.
    That mostly applies to gender and equality discussions though

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